It makes you wonder if some elected officials have too much time on their hands or simply want to flex their muscles. In this case Mission Viejo Mayor Frank Ury, whose children do not attend public schools in Mission Viejo, is leading the charge against the Saddleback Valley Unified School District, SVUSD, because of that elected School Board’s decision to close two of our schools.
For full transparency it is important to let readers know that after serving one term on the SVUSD Board of Trustees, 1992-1996, Frank was defeated in his bid for reelection.
Some additional data. While I can understand the frustration of parents whose children attend the O’Neil Elementary School that is being closed and are being transferred elsewhere, no one has expressed any concern for the decision to also close LaTierra Elementary which was included in the 2008 listing of CA Distinguished Schools. O’Neil has not won that honor since 1989, 20 years ago.
Having lived in Mission Viejo before we became a city 20 years ago it is worth pointing out that our “master planned” bedroom community was created with two school districts with SVUSD serving the homes in the northern part of town and the Capo district, CVUSD, for those homes to the south. While there is no clearly defined 38th parallel we have had this arrangement in place for over 20 years. At no time before Frank Ury became mayor did Mission Viejo engage in any discussion of changing that structure.
Let’s get the emotion of a school closure out of the way. The city of Mission Viejo has been “built out” for several years and have no new housing in the pipeline. With housing prices so high it is very difficult for young families to qualify to purchase homes (or even find low cost apartment rentals) in our city. Lacking the 2010 census I am unable to document the decline in the number of grammar or intermediate school age children in our city. I have been told that SVUSD enrollment has dropped by around 500 students which in itself represents a total student body for a grammar school.
So the city manager retains the services of Adam Probolsky, Probolsky Research, to survey our residents regarding creation of a single school district to serve our city.
Let me give an example of a fictitious survey “push” question:
Someone offers you 2 box seat tickets to attend games three or four of the playoff series between the Yankees and the Angels at the Big A this weekend.
1. Would you accept the tickets
YES 99%
NO 1% (prefer golf)
2. If you answered yes to the above question, and have to pay for your own transportation and parking, would you accept the free tickets?
YES 95%
NO 5%
Getting serious let’s look at a real question from the survey of 325 residents.
“The city of Mission Viejo might be able to help facilitate the creation of a new Mission Viejo School District, which would entail the expenditure of City resources.
21. In general would you support or oppose the City of Mission Viejo spending taxpayer funds to help facilitate the creation of a new school district that delivers education specifically to students who live within the city of Mission Viejo?
Strongly support 23.7%
Strongly oppose 25.2%
[If answered support for Q21]
22. Thinking specifically, why would you say that you support the City of Mission Viejo spending taxpayer funds to help facilitate the creation of a new school district that delivers education specifically to students who live within the City of Mission Viejo?
Support education spending in general 24.3%
[If answered oppose to 21]
23. Thinking specifically, why would you say that you oppose the City of Mission Viejo spending taxpayer funds to help facilitate the creation of a new school district that delivers education specifically to students who live within the City of Mission Viejo?
Oppose new spending in general/don’t have the funds 38.3%
Let’s take a long look at this survey starting with the fact that the voters were not asked if they have children in the school districts until the final question #28 which reads as follows:
And now for demographic purposes only:
28. Do you have children who currently attend K-12 school?
YES 32.3%,
NO 67.4%
refused 0.3%.”
So, on the basis of less than a third of parents of K-12 students the city manager cranks up the spin machine touting the citizens desire to form our own school district in his newsletter of this past Friday.
Another minor detail overlooked. While polling the voters the documentation for the polling, that will be discussed under Agenda Item #25 on Monday, does not contain a single word of the potential costs if the City decides to take on this restructuring.
Back to my Angels/Yankees tickets. What if I changed the question to ask if you would pay $100-$500 per ticket. Would you still vote YES?
Everyone can all find fault with the school districts just as we do with our city council. Unfortunately this August 19-23 polling by Probolsky Research misses the mark by failing to provide more background information to the voters. Amazing that none of the voters contacted questioned the cost of this drastic “knee jerk” proposal.
There are too many government entities on O.C. now. We need them to consolidate to reduce total overhead costs and gain other efficiencies. Creating more of them is going in the wrong direction – taxpayers cannot afford all this government any more! How about a serious proposal to merge some of the south county cities into a single city, thereby eliminating multiple paid City Councils, City Managers, public works directors, etc.?
Mayor Frank Ury has expressed nothing but contempt for public education. The voters rejected him for a second term on the school board. Ury’s mission was to destroy the teachers union. He still has that desire suggesting the teachers take a big pay cut while he voted himself a raise and lifetime health care benefits at the cities expense.
Note: Ury’s children attend PRIVATE SCHOOL.
Note: Ury attended PRIVATE COLLEGES–Notre Dame, and USC.
This is a flat out crazy idea by an elitist that is being funded by the tax payers in Mission Viejo.
Maybe it is time to recall Ury–just like “angry man ” Lance MacLean is being recalled.
Mr. Polk.
The amazing thing about the city manager’s Newsletter is that he put a happy face on our residents desire to create this major restructuring of our school districts when there are other options, especially when around 100 residents contacted by Adam have students in our K-12 school system.
1. Recall the Board of Trustees
2. Vote them out of office when they are up for reelection
3. Place the question on a ballot and let the 62,298 registered voters of Mission Viejo have direct input in creating our own school district before investing their tax dollars for a vocal minority which is where this began.
What an insane idea. Accurate observation that MV is built out and enrollment numbers are dropping in SVUSD. CUSD numbers are up a bit. Remember that students from San Juan Capistrano are still bused up to Viejo Elementary and Newhart. It’s difficult to tell the numbers of MV students by looking at the school sites. So, if Mission Viejo were to take on the burder of creating a school district, the challenges would be immense. I’m fine with starting a range war as long as the Urynator gets caught in the middle.
As a parent I highly endorse the idea of looking at a consolidated school district that encompasses all of the schools within the city of Mission Viejo. Why should the city be divided into 2 separate school districts? The current plan is an artifact of a time when the population of the area was lower and more widely dispersed. We have been left with a system that is gerrymandered, over-sized, unaccountable, under-funded, and overly politicized. I say we should seriously look at Mission Viejo taking local control of the city’s schools.
Tom.
Be careful what you ask for!
I can picture it now. The very same unions that kicked Frank Ury out of the SVUSD Board of Trustees will represent the teachers of the new Mission Viejo school district.
Using your logic we should have our own congressman. Why does Gary Miller represent other OC cities where he may have a conflict in meeting their requests that take away funding from Mission Viejo?
In fact the same applies to our state assemblyman. We are after all the “safest city” in America and deserve to have our own, 100 percent of his time and efforts, assemblyman fighting for us….period!
Those who have been looped in to Ury’s spitting contest with SVUSD should look up occasionally to see where it’s going. It is up to the two school districts (not a group of MV constituents) to decide about dividing into smaller agencies. They would have to give up their student populations, tax base — their revenue streams — as well as their power. While it’s hypothetically possible, what are the chances? Instead of wasting energy contributing to Frank Ury’s political ploy, why not look for real solutions? Dissatisfied constituents should run for school board or back someone they know and trust who will represent their interests on the board.
Painful Uru Nation.
Well stated. We don’t need to look back decades for a solution if a problem exists. Simply look at the recall in our other school district, CVUSD.
If you are not satifsfied with actions taken by your elected School Board Trustees you can throw them out of office with a recall or simply wait until the next election.
What Mr Ury is stirring up has more impact to the results than anyone comprehends.
Again I need to point out that none of his children attend public K-12 schools.
That’s a bit of a straw man argument, don’t you think, Larry?
This is the closing comment in an email to me from a former elected official opposing this idea that says it all.
“P.S. Half this C.C. are jerks!”
Food for thought.
Is Mayor Ury trying to get back at the teachers union for shooting down his reelection to the SVUSD Board by forming a Mission Viejo School District with non-union teachers? Hmmm?
SVUSD spends 83% of MV tax dollars outside of the City of MV. How do you justify that? If we are going to get attendance funds THEY SHOULD STAY IN MV!!
Worry less about the City Council, and more about us getting screwed by Fish, Atkins, and SVUSD.
Think! – we are getting lower quality education, massive cuts in programs, Fish lies and denies, they violate the Brown Act, Zoning laws, Traffic Laws, and Fish imports a bunch of thugs from Foothill into MV that we should supplement their La Cross and their Smart Boards. For some one who claims to be pro-MV, why do you settle for a 3rd rate education mismanaged by SVUSD, decreasing home values that it will bring, lowering the attractiveness of MV to families, when we can have a pro family community?
Or are you just a grump?
Gilbert Loves to Waste Taxes!
Folks. There are times when I may sit on a reference document for years with the thought of springing it at the appropriate time. This writer has just provided that opening. Last week we went to a Disney employee sale at their warehouse in Anaheim where I picked up a baseball cap that I have yet to wear.
It reads. “I’m GRUMPY because you are DOPEY!”
This story is not about the education of our children. It’s about a “push” poll that was full of holes. Three of our children were educated in the SVUSD and graduated from MVHS.
If the city council had a concern about our school districts, and spent over $20,000 conducting another resident “opinion survey” by True North one year ago, why did they fail to include questions about this topic at that time??????????????
Very clever Larry. When faced with facts, you quote cartoons.
In answer to your question, both MV and the parents were blind sided by Fish/Atkins/SVUSD withholding of information about school closures until the years end. After elections. And when they did not get the desired answer, the re-did the vote after violating the Brown Act. The MV survey didn’t ask about school issues – it was before Fish’s illegal acts. I can give you a detailed time line if you desire.
You’re 3 kids went to SVUSD and you are happy? BFD. It was before the Fish/Atkins regime of malfeasance and incompetence. My wife, her 2 brothers, my brother, and I all graduated from MVHS. Btwn us, we have 2 PhDs, 1 Masters, 1 Lawyer, and 1 Engineer. I know what quality SVUSD used to produce, and this current group is far from that.
You claim your “article” was about a push poll??? Obviously you can’t read your own BS. You spent half the article bagging on Ury and the strings follow that. Who cares if Ury went to private school? Who cares if his kids do? I would to if faced with SVUSD. Are you one those embittered Obama types b/c YOU couldn’t hack it? What I care about from our Mayor and CC is what we can do to improve our local community. You claim to be a fiscal conservative, meanwhile you want us to pay for your own recall, while speculating that a MVUSD is nothing more then a politicians get back. JFC.
So I ask you again. And focus really hard on this. Why do you turn your back of SVUSD’s blatant theft of 83% of Mission Viejo student funding for other cities? I am sure if the CC did this, you’d be thoroughly apoplectic.
So lay off the cartoons, no more “Voltron,” and THINK.
And write a real, coherent answer. Bet that you will not.
Nice Mickey Mouse Hat.
Gilbert Loves to Waste Taxes
Mr. know it all. The city council is a separate elected body and has “no control” over the actions taken or curriculum established by either of our school districts.
If you have been so unhappy with their actions, and the alleged decline in student performance, simply follow what is happening with councilman Lance MacLean and begin a recall of the SVUSD Board of Trustees.
Take note that the city bought and paid for Probolsky Research survey confirmed that 24.9% of those polled on their opinion of the district said that they found SVUSD to be very favorable. Another 34.8% felt that they were somewhat favorable of the district while only 3.7% said very unfavorable. 5.2% responded somewhat unfavorable. Hopefully you were one of the residents contacted. In any event, based on your comments you fall into the group of 3.7%. Not exactly a mandate for CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
PS: I am not really impressed with how many framed degrees you have hanging on your office wall in terms of this discussion.
Wow Larry – You still won’t answer the question – why are you so indifferent to 83% of MV tax dollars being siphoned off to other cities? I win the bet!
First you are against the poll, and now you are for it??
Answer, Larry, answer. Why do you want 83% of MV student funds flowing out of the city??
As far as degrees go, you were the one that brought up his 3 “alleged” kids went thru MVHS (having met your wife, who is a gracious class act, I find it hard to believe she would consent to intimacy with you.) My point was to show you what SVUSD was once capable of, and how how much it has deteriorated since then.
We need a City of MV Unified School District. A recall like you “tax and spend types” advocate against SVUSD is unrealistic – there are approximately 110,000 registered voters in SVUSD, spread over several cities. So to meet the threshold, we would need 20,000 votes for a recall. Then we have to win – and why would Lake Forest or Foothill Ranch or Laguna Hills vote for something that benefits MV, and we keep our money, while Fish rains $$$ upon them? And then we are still stuck with your boyfriend Fish at SVUSD. It is in MV’s interest to dump SVUSD all together, take their schools, and get the student funding.
So, again Larry – why are you so indifferent to 83% of MV tax dollars being siphoned off to other cities?
Or are you so full of hatred and venom for our current CC that you won’t admit you are wrong?
Gilbert Loves to Waste Taxes!
Question for the genius. How long has Mission Viejo’s being an education “donor city,” as alleged in your remarks, been a concern of yours? This is the first time we have heard from you. Did this abuse of Mission Viejo tax dollars happen overnight?
Somehow Mr Rip Van Winkle you have surfaced from under a rock and think that the city has the power and authority to trump the school district. Wrong assumption!
Win the bet? We are a “donor city” to both SAC and Washington, DC. That’s the benefit of living in southern CA. That’s life in this city.
Having been involved in our city politics since cityhood I do not recall meeting anyone named “Gilbert Loves to Waste Taxes” It must be very unsettling for you being in the minority when less than 4% of the voters contacted by Adam Probolsky agree with you.
My issues with Adam’s polling relates to the timing and omission of questions. I assume that the percentages in his report, which I have quoted above, are correct. If he changes them I will alter the data.
Don’t cop out now. Weren’t you warned? Didn’t you read our fine print before entering the fray? You have entered the Juice arena where, at the end of the post, only one man or one woman will remain standing as we take no prisoners.
Don’t wimp out on us now. The volunteers in the MacLean recall gathered almost 14,000 signatures. As you are so passionate on this budgetary issue let me suggest that you find at least one other person who agrees with your argument and start gathering recall petition signatures.
We did it to remove governor Davis which required considerably more than 20,000 petition signatures.
Do all of us a favor and read your boasting of all the PhDs you have. [” Btwn us, we have 2 PhDs, 1 Masters, 1 Lawyer, and 1 Engineer.”] My only point in mentioning MVHS, which is in the SVUSD, was that our children attended and graduated from that school which confirms my having had direct experience with the school district at the center of the current debate. I did not brag about any of our children’s or my personal higher education achievements.
The good news is that am not hiding my identity and am here for the duration. You can check out at any time and we will never know who you are.
So, again Larry – why are you so indifferent to 83% of MV tax dollars being siphoned off to other cities?
I am tired of the Johnny Come Lately types like you showing up in MV and claiming to be concerned for us.
So why won’t you answer the question?