Torturing each other isn’t what blogging should be about…
I am supposed to go tomorrow to the office of Todd Gallinger, the attorney the guys from the Liberal OC hired to sue me over what really amounts to a frivolous case.
I am not going.
I have been fretting for weeks, trying to find an attorney to help me defend myself. I came close last week, but I decided to let the poor guy off the hook after he made it clear he didn’t know much about the law in question.
Today I decided that enough is enough. I am not going to mount a defense. If these guys want to run me over with a tank, well I am going to lie down in front of it and let them.
A few months ago they were asking me to fork over ten thousand dollars. God knows how much they want now. Sorry – but I am no longer playing along with this.
One thing that has become crystal clear to me over the past few months is that this Orange County blog war needs to end. I have made such overtures to the Liberal OC bloggers, to no avail. They smell blood in the water. Well guys, go ahead.
While I cannot dissuade them, I can do something to end this blog war once and for all. And that is exactly what I intend to do.
It is easy to villify the Liberal OC bloggers – and they certainly have done that to me. Well, no more. I am not going to allow them to be attacked on this blog henceforth. Whether or not they decide to drop the case, I am going to do what I can to end this madness.
And it certainly is madness. Just this week one of the Liberal OC guys, we think, (this has been denied by the Liberal OC’s editor) called the Anaheim police department to complain about an anonymous comment made over at the Friends for Fullerton’s Future blog. They told the police that our blogger, Sean Mill, was the culprit. The comment in question was a threat to cut the brake lines on Harry Sidhu’s car.
That comment was inexcusable, and quite frankly the FFFF guys should not have allowed it. But no, Mill didn’t write it. But this is how poisonous the O.C. political blogosphere as become. Enough.
Mill’s dinner was interrupted that night by two Anaheim cops. Not cool.
We are all grown men. It is time to start acting like it.
When the Liberal OC guys bought my personal URL from a guy I thought was my friend (Ryan Trabuco) I saw red. I have never been so mad in my life. I know now that I erred by returning fire. It was wrong. I should have been a bigger man and walked away.
I also know that it would be childish for me to keep holding this against Trabuco. At the time he was working for Supervisor Janet Nguyen. I have no doubt that she encouraged him to backstab me. She knows a thing or two about doing that to her friends.
I treated Trabuco like family. When his appendix burst Paul Lucas and I were the only guys in town that went to see him in the hospital. I wrote the only mailer he sent out when he ran for the State Assembly. And he still stabbed me in the back. But I think Nguyen put him up to it.
I was once very close with Nguyen. In fact she even appointed me to a County Commission. I resigned from that post however when it became clear to me that it was hurting her within her own party. That is how much I cared about her.
How did she return the favor? When I ran for the Santa Ana City Council, in 2008, I did so on a lark. But I felt it was important not to allow Councilman Carlos Bustamante to run unchallenged.
I asked Nguyen to stay out of the race. Two days later she endorsed Bustamante.
You have to understand, in my book you are either with me or against me. There is no in-between. When Nguyen betrayed me that was it. She called me later and asked me to come have a beer with her. But it was over and I had moved on.
We have scrutinized Nguyen’s every move ever since, and I suspect that is part of the reason the Liberal OC guys hate me so much. Why?
Well, losing in politics is no fun. The Liberal OC is very closely aligned with Nick Berardino and the O.C. Employees Association, because one of the Liberal OC editors works for Nick and is a union leader.
The OCEA has lost and lost for years. In fact they had their teeth kicked in again in the recent Primary Election. The only victory they can point to in the last dozen or so years is paying for the recount that put Nguyen in office.
So you see, you don’t challenge Nguyen unless you want to draw the ire of the Liberal OC and the OCEA.
That happened to me in my Council race. Nick and one of the Liberal OC editors joined forces with Matt Cunningham of Red County, and a slew of folks that hate my guts, and they paid for a mailer telling the voters in my city that I am nuts.
But you see, that’s the rub. I am no monster. You would not know that to read the Liberal OC. But you know what? They aren’t monsters either, as hard as that might be to believe.
We’re all a bunch of guys trying to make a difference in local politics. Some of us are better at it than the others, but none of us are any worse or any better.
It has gotten so bad that when the O.C. Register featured me in a recent article, talking about keeping Latino workers safe, someone went over there and posted libelous remarks about me, including links back to the Liberal OC. The Register ended up deleting the comment.
This villifying of each other simply has to stop. The stalking behavior has to stop as well, on all sides. It isn’t right for us as bloggers to go to the homes of politicians and invade their privacy, even if they are carpetbaggers.
It isn’t right to call one’s employer and try to get folks fired because they are bloggers.
It isn’t right to call the police over blog comments.
And it is certainly not right to pick a fight with someone then sue him when he retaliates.
Enough. I have had enough and I expect that you, our readers, have likewise had enough.
Many of the bloggers in question have had a rough time of it over the past few years. It wasn’t right for one of my bloggers to reference the financial issues of one of the Liberal OC guys. And it wasn’t right for them to do the same to me.
I walked away from a six figure income shortly after the November election in 2008. My boss asked me to lie about worker’s comp cases and I refused. That company has since gotten into all sorts of hot water with OSHA.
I almost bankrupted myself in the process. And I am now fighting to save my home.
I cannot afford to deal with this lawsuit distraction anymore. My blood pressure is way up and I cannot sleep anymore. Enough.
If the Liberal OC guys want to destroy me, then I hope they enjoy it. I am getting off this hate train.
The only thing I ask of you, my readers, is that you please consider contacting the Liberal OC guys and asking them to drop the case.
You can contact the Liberal OC’s editor, Dan Chmielewski, at this link.
You can contact their lawyer, Todd Gallinger, at this link.
I don’t know that they will listen, or care. They will likely go on with my crucifixion.
But this is it for me. I am not playing along and I am not going to lose any more sleep over this mess. If the Liberal OC guys want to destroy me, then they should go ahead and do it then. Just don’t expect me to play along.
We are moving on and I can but hope that they will too.
Chmielewski recently put up a post about his son’s graduation. Congrats to them both. I was most pleased to attend my daughter’s graduation, from FIDM, last weekend. And all three of my boys were given awards by their schools, as their school year drew to a close. My oldest son is in fact in Sacramento this week, on a trip with a bunch of brilliant boys who are learning about politics.
You see? Both Chmielewski and I are good fathers. We aren’t monsters at all, but you wouldn’t know it by our mutually destructive behavior.
Well, this blog won’t be engaging in that B.S. anymore. Even if these guys decide to wreck me, I am forgiving them and moving on. I hope they accept my apology for all the mess we have all been mired in for the past few years.
This poisonous crap isn’t what blogging should be about. Well, we won’t be engaging in that anymore. I hope the other blogs in town follow suit.
My father warned me years ago that I should stay out of politics, and writing. One of his cousins was a journalist in Mexico, who was assassinated for writing about someone who took umbrage at his reporting.
I don’t have to worry about knives and guns coming my way, but it is clear that the Liberal OC bloggers are trying to destroy me with their lawsuit, essentially because we do not agree much on political matters. I should have listened to my father, I guess. It just isn’t worth it, is it?
Don’t get me wrong. We will keep on doing what we do best here – and on our sister blog, New Santa Ana. But for us the blog war is over, even if I end up being its ultimate victim.
Art, I read this piece and feel your pain. As a regular reader of the blogs in question I must say this battle has been difficult to watch. So much talent wasted in the petty sniping back and forth and so much emotional energy wasted over the past several years! You ALL have much to contribute to the political discourse in Orange County and it’s OK if you don’t agree – that’s what makes it fun.
I only hope you will be able to hold the line.. I fear it may not be as easy as you think. I do wish you luck, though.
Art,
This is one of the most sensible posts you’ve written in a long time. I’m sure that everything that has happened is not 100% your fault. But you’ve done a lot to contribute to the situation.
If you are serious about this, you can try to change the way you handle yourself. You can’t control others, but you can (I hope) control your self. There is no need to start petty fights and if someone else starts one, there is no need to continue it.
I’m thinking of lots of examples I’ve seen over the years, but don’t have time to go through many of them and I doubt you’d pay attention anyway.
I think your philosophy of “with me or against me” is partly to blame. You have to pick your battles.
One of the most important battles someone will go through is running for office and it’s easy to take someone’s lack of support personally. But you cannot expect people to go all in for you when you run “on a lark.” If you aren’t serious about your campaign your self, why should someone go out on a limb for you. If you were a real friend, you wouldn’t put them in that position. If you were dead serious, it would be different but when you run solely because someone shouldn’t run unopposed, you look like Orly Taitz.
A few other parting thoughts;
– be nice
– don’t write really inflammatory things about others (you can get important information out without being an ass)
– if you really have to write something inflammatory, make sure it’s true first.
If you can start doing something of these things (and temper yourself when others don’t do them) then maybe the blog war will end.
John,
Thanks for the advice.
I never would have run against Bustamante if the Democrats had done their job and recruited a candidate. So yes it was a lark, but the intentions were good. And sure enough, Bustamante has been pretty much MIA, as usual.
And I don’t get the Taitz comparison. I had a very good platform as a candidate. I am not a nutter or a birther or a Republican. We ran on solid issues and I gave Bustamante hell at the debates, in Spanish and English.
I do agree however that all sides involved have contributed to this nasty mess. I cannot get the rest of them to go along with this, but we will try to do our part here at the Orange Juice and I know our editor, Vern, will help me in this regard.
Thanks for reading the Orange Juice.
I know our editor, Vern, will help me in this regard.
Oh – that’s me!
I think the idea now is no more “personal attacks” on Dan, Chris & Claudio. That’s fine with me. I’m still gonna rip ’em when they commit their trademark hackery. If I notice.
Vern,
I would expect no less my friend.
Art,
Wow. Interesting. I have commented under 2, now 3 different Orange Juice blogs.
I usually blog or leave comments in Deafread.com. Some deaf people there say that Deafread disparage other deaf people, name calling and many other negative remarks about other deaf people. So, their is a dumb movement to “stop dvtv and deafread” there. It is still going strong.
The thing is, some deaf people say that why do deaf people do that and you do not see hearing bloggers do that? I read your blog, your testimony and know that deaf bloggers are just as normal as hearing bloggers. We are in the same boat. We do need to tone it down, but sometimes it is hard to prevent that. The reason is to counter an offensive blogger to make a point, and they do the same, then it seems to never end.
Thanks.
~BBF
(do you accept request to remove some comment by its own author?)
BigBenFactor,
Yes, I do accept such requests.
The AB 2072 situation has been quite a mess. However, if there is an upside, it is that deaf voters in our state are now awake and energized and involved in politics. I hope they stay involved. They too have a big stake in what happens to our state.
Thanks for reading the Orange Juice!
Art,
That is interesting. Hopefully it will encourage deaf people to be involve in politics in California and rest of country and stay involved as you put it. . I had not looked at it that way.
~BBF
So you think you can spew tons of garbage out of your pie-hole all these years and then lie down and play martyr? Do you think we’re so dumb to fall for your crocodile tears? You brought this on yourself. I guess the douchebags I went to high school ended up becoming bloggers as adults. I guess the douchiness doesn’t fade with time. You sound like a sniveling little girl. Taste your own medicine for a while.
So long, Art. Don’t let the door hit you on the ass on the way out.
Hector,
Welcome to the Orange Juice blog. Your comments aren’t terribly helpful but then I don’t think they were meant to be.
All sides have contributed to this rancor. All I am saying is that someone has to take the first step towards ending this and I am doing exactly that.
My true thought on this and Vern will hate me for it:
Vern is too damn good for this blog… and he’s being manipulated by Art. I see that clearly after he made Vern editor. Vern became editor and Art flooded this freakin board with hateful ridiculous posts using multiple names, Art, Zorro, Admin and how many other names, who knows? The guy just will not shut up! Just how much control does Vern really have?
I personally cannot stand Janet Nguyen, but you, ART, somehow have managed to get me to feel for her. You’re like a “woman scorned”. You’re so hurt because Janet dumped you. Attacking her once in a while is one thing, but your constant attacking and connecting her office to every single event in life to make her look bad just makes you look stupid. And you have no shame telling us your history with Janet. Ok, let me restate it for you… basically, you were on your knees sucking on Janet’s weeener because you loved her so much. AND of course, you want her to love you back. Instead she dumped you for another man, so now you’re whining, crying, stumping your feet, trying get back at her. Is that basically what the story is?
Damn Vern, I liked the orangejuiceblog and was happy to hear news of you becoming editor. I was looking forward to a high quality political blog. A place to get news, discussions and debate as well. Instead, sorry Vern, you becoming editor was a strategic move on Art’s part… and you’re being used big time.
I would love to be on a blog where you actually are the man in charge.
I don’t hate you Lam, but take it easy on our friend Art who created this great space and is really going thru hell right now because of these blog wars.
I think we’ll have the kind of blog you dream of very soon.
Lam,
I am sorry you feel so way and that are resorting to such crude sexual language to make your point.
Vern is our editor and he has already acted to bring in new writers and to change the tone of the place.
We talk regularly and have a good partnership in place.
The fact is however that this blog will die without my posts. Our readership data shows that. Were I to crawl off and leave it be, it would not survive.
I do listen to Vern and he has full admin powers here. Not sure what else you want.
****MEMO TO THE GUY SENDING MY COMMENTS TO MY EMPLOYER, I AM AT LUNCH AND USING MY OWN COMPUTER. PLEASE NOTE THAT IN YOUR EMAIL TO THEM****
“I would love to be on a blog where you actually are the man in charge.”
Lam,
You are free to go elsewhere whenever you’d like. So why don’t you? You piss and moan but you always return.
The fact of the matter is that Art Pedroza built this forum and it allows just about anyone and everyone to state their opinions and piss and moan if they’d like. For that we all should be thankful. Art has put a lot of time and effort into this blog and as a result of that it has quite a large following in the local blogosphere.
Speaking of “hateful and ridiculous” what about your pontifications that Vietnamese are somehow superior to Mexicans. That is pretty hateful and ridiculous in its own right and yet Art Pedroza allowed you the right to show the world how hateful and ridiculous you are in spouting such nonsense.
Art Pedroza has earned the right to post on this blog and your comment “The guy just will not shut up!” is just so out of place. Art Pedroza built this blog and has done more than anyone else to grow it. Maybe it is you that should “shut up”. And after the disgusting sexual analogy you used in this last comment the sooner the better.
Galatians 6:7
A Man reaps what he sows
ocgirrl,
True. But if we are going to start quoting the Bible you also ought to reference the need to forgive and to turn the other cheek, to be fair.
ocgirl. If you want to reference scripture perhaps you might read Ephesians 4 v 32
“Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.”
Art,
I know what you are going through.
The conversations we have had helped me to move on and see “light at the end of the tunnel.” I hope that you too will find that light and realize that all will be well.
This is why the OC Progressive is where I blog, I wanted no part in any of this, in how you treat each other, speak of each other and of candidates, etc. I don’t see how this helps people care about politics, become more engaged or want to even run for office.
In fact, I think it only dissuades people from becoming involved when we have people tearing each other apart over things like this. As much as I hate catch phrases, it is the politics of personal destruction.
I’m sorry, bloggers should not be more important than the stories, the issues nor the people they write about.
I hope this is resolved soon and that there is some sanity brought to OC Politics on the blogosphere. The whole point of blogging is to inform and attempt to get more people involved not to scare the shit out of them.
The only way to prove that things will change is to see them change. I really don’t care who reads my writing, if my blog is number 1 or dead last, I just wanted a place to write without worrying if I’m going to get attacked personally for just having a point of view.
This is what happens in pissing contests, everyone just winds up smelling like urine. I hope this all gets settled soon and you can start focusing on things that are important, like education, health care, etc.
And I don’t claim to be perfect, far from it, I’m just a blogger with an opinion, and you know what they say about those, everyone’s got one.
All the best to you Art.
The importance of revealing the actions of our elected officials is crucial to a healthy democracy. The questionable patterns of behavior of Supervisor Janet Nguyen are worthy of multiple mentions. She routinely throws people under the bus. The latest victim is her former Chief of Staff, Garden Grove City Council Carpetbagger, Andrew Do. He was forced to leave her employment as the fall guy due to the disastrous Black April episode. She has shredded what little credibility she once possessed. She is history come next election.
Another stick in the eye,
Try being a brick wall instead.
Seriously Sean, you have no idea how pathetic you are. You can’t hold your own on any argument. You get ripped apart on practically every issue you’re passionate about. We all have seen Art jumped in to bail your butt out every time… so in that respect, I suppose I don’t blame you for sticking up to Art. After all, what exactly are you worth without Art? You’re a one trick pony.
In case the metaphor was lost, all I am saying is that Art deserves it after all the mean name calling when he thought he was the big man. I hold no ill will, but karma can be pretty rough sometimes.
ocgirrl,
With all due respect, no one deserves this.
I am trying to bury the hatchet and move on. I hope others will too. Someone has to take the first step…
One more Bible verse for you – “let he who is without sin cast the first stone…”
“…such crude sexual language to make your point.”
Yeah, but Art… I made my point, didn’t I?
If you supported Janet because you believed in her and thought she would do well serving our community. But now you are against her because you see her true nature; how she had hurt so many people and her policies had negatively affected our community. Then Art, you would earn my respect!!
But listening to your own version of the story Art… the bottom line is you don’t care about her or how her policies affect our community. You just care about whether or not she supports you. Had Janet supported you and everything else about her remains exactly the same, you would be on your knees today praising the lord for our wonderful supervisor, wouldn’t you? It’s disingenuous when you talk about politics, policies or community, because the bottom line is it’s all about you, Art.
Lam,
I took the liberty of deleting the exchange between you and Sean as it was not very germane to this post.
Now as to your comment here, understand that I met with Janet before she ran and asked her what her top three issues were. She replied business then could not come up with any other answers.
I was willing to give her the benefit of the doubt because she stood with the non-union contractors against more than one union-only project labor agreement. And I was hoping that over time she would eventually grow into the position.
However, it is quite apparent now that she hasn’t done so. I was most upset, for example, when she voted against letter-grade health ratings for restaurants, particularly when I found out that her husband’s restaurant was a top violator. And then I did the research and found out she took over $20,000 in campaign contributions from other restaurants owners with major health violations on record.
And recently she tried to take over the Little Saigon community’s Black April event. We know how that turned out.
My advice to her when she got elected was to be non-partisan and to be everyone’s Supervisor. She has failed in that regard. Indeed shortly after her election she selected a Hispanic Advisory Committee made up of only Republicans. Most of them didn’t live in the district.
I did not ask her for an endorsement. I asked her to stay out of my race. When the Lincoln Club declined to endorse Bustamante, it gave her a reason to follow suit. She endorsed him anyway.
You don’t treat friends like that Lam.
Art to the Liberal O.C. Blog:
“The best years of my life, I was a fool to give you you
Alright, already, I’m just a no-goodnick!
Alright, already, it’s true.
So new.
So sue me, sue me
What can you do me?
I love you “
Trippy. This is the same guy who, calling himself “The South Will Rise Again,” boldly commented:
“When thousands of illegal immigrants march on May Day.. It will be very, very bad news…”
It will be good news for Hunt!
Your guy didn’t do so well. And now you’re a Broadway fool?
Lam.
I’m not as forgiving as others on the Juice team regarding your personal attacks. Take note!
How about a fundraiser for Art to help him save his house? We could hold it in the Artist’s Village in Downtown Santa Ana. Maybe Mr. Vern could play the piano and we could invite other local bands to play as well. It’s time for the Blogging community to step up and help one of our own who has fallen on hard times because of his craft. Remember…
All gave some..but some gave all! We are with you brother Art!
Pass the Hat,
That is very kind. Thank you.
We are working on a loan modification. I am hoping for the best.
You can help however by contacting the Liberal OC bloggers and asking them to drop this case. That will be a big help! And please encourage your friends to follow suit.
Thanks!
“We are working on a loan modification. I am hoping for the best. ”
Art..I check on Zillow.com and it seems your home is worth $414,500. Did you get taken by one of these loan fraud deals that has plagued our Hispanic community? Have you thought about a short sale? Maybe one of your readers has the $400,000 or so needed to buy your house and allow you and your family to get a fresh start. My Tia is a real estate broker in La Puente if you need help with this. Just let us know how we can help. Maybe some readers could help you with payments for a few months until you get back on your feet. It’s the least we can do for you after all you have done for the Latino community.
Olmec Nation,
When times were good we signed a mortgage deal that turned out to be no bueno. After I quit that six figure job (when my boss asked me to lie about workers comp cases) things went south very quickly.
I am very touched by your support! So often we fight these battles and folks don’t even know what we are going through. It has been tough.
If the loan mod fails it will be time to roll up our sleeves and try plan b I guess.
I am working my tail off and am now also involved in distributing an amazing new green product that helps plants to capture energy lost on heated lines. It is exciting to get my foot in the green door, so to speak.
Thanks for your support! Please ask your friends to contact the guys at the Liberal OC and ask them to drop their lawsuit. Gracias!
Blogging Freedom Is Not Free
the forgotten blog war,
That is true. We put our necks on the line every time we write a post…
Art & The Forgotten Blog War,
If I may add to Art’s comment to The Forgotten Blog War, … “and comment”.
LOL
So what are you going to do Larry Gilbert? Seriously, you guys think too much of yourself. I use one moniker and one moniker only. The day Vern or Art say Lam Pho, you are no longer welcome here… believe me, that’s the day I will leave and won’t come back using another moniker or IP address. Take note? take note of what Larry? Seriously, I need you to explain that to me… because if that is a threat, I do not and will not take it lightly.
Please explain… you need to explain!!!
and Art, you have reasons to attack Janet. You say she’s a back stabber and doesn’t treat her friends well. I know that all too well. But you must admit that you have extended your attack on issues that had little to do with her. That backfired on you.
Larry Gilbert, explain your take note comment.
Lam,
Not at all. I have gone after Janet on policy issues. I thought I made that clear. My apologies if I failed to do so.
Last time I checked the Orange Juice blog had just over 400,000 readers. If we all gave just $1 to Art to pay down his home loan he could own his house free and clear and get back to blogging where he belongs.
Art..good news..I took your advice above and contacted some people who know some people on the inside of the LiberalOC and word on the street is that they all read this post and are VERY close to dropping the whole thing. I think they now see you are a humanbean too.
Let’s all give,
If that is true, that would be a true God-send! If I don’t have to deal with the lawsuit it will leave me more time to try to resolve my financial issues. I don’t care about myself but my kids are good kids and they deserve a roof over their heads.
And my wife, well she is a saint. We just celebrated our 23rd anniversary. I would love to say we went out to a wonderful dinner. But I ended up painting my mom’s house and was too tired to do anything that night. I may be gray, but I am still her mijo!
Thank you!
But this whole thing is about Art’s personal attacks and infantile behavior. I seem to remember him making fun of Sal Tinajero’s weight several times, and hundreds of other childish personal attacks – that is not politics blogging – that is just juvenile and downright stupid. I am not casting any stones; I said I bear no ill will. That being said, looking from outside your circle, this looks like justice served. Doesn’t mean I wish anything bad for you, it just seems like you are getting your comeuppance. I would imagine that an actual, heartfelt apology to whoever is suing you would go a long way.
ocgirrl,
Many things are ascribed to me that often are comments by readers.
I took umbrage when Sal hopped on board Team Pulido after his election. However, as time went by I came to realize that City Council Members in Santa Ana don’t have much of a choice.
If anything is true about me it is that I am willing to change my mind. I was once the biggest advocate of the GOP you would ever find. Not true now, is it?
Even at the ripe age of 42, I am still learning and still changing my ways. When we stop being open to change, that is the end.
Now look back at my posts and tell me truly that the majority are hateful attacks. They aren’t.
‘
I have always tried to make this an entertaining blog and I do have a quirky sense of humor. There is a difference however between being humorous and being downright nasty. I have never tried to be the latter, whatever you may opt to believe.
“I have gone after Janet on policy issues”
Art, I know that you have. Even a few times when you attacked her character, I supported you because I know where you’re coming from. She is no doubt a vicious person. But there were times when you really stretched your suspicions and connected her to things, just to make her look back. Even for a guy like me, who cannot stand her, I had to step back to rethink your position.
Oh, and I’m sorry to hear about your situation with the house. From the heart Art… really sorry to hear it man. If you refused to lie for your boss and quit your high paying job, then hats off to you. You’re a much bigger man than I thought. Best of luck, be careful out there. I hope you find the right source for help.
“We just celebrated our 23rd anniversary. I would love to say we went out to a wonderful dinner. But I ended up painting my mom’s house and was too tired to do anything that night”
That is so wrong! Art…had you asked any of us who post on O.J. (with one or two exceptions) we would have gladly paid for you and your lovely bride to go out to eat on your anniversary. Why don’t you plan something still…I’m serious….steak dinner with all the fixens! I”m in for $5 right now, what say my fellow bloggers?
“Lam.
I’m not as forgiving as others on the Juice team regarding your personal attacks. Take note!”
Yo Lam..sounds to me like ol Larry is getting ready to open a can of Whoop-Ass on ya!
Closest thing to a threat I dun read in some time!
Grim Reeper, you got that right. I demand an explanation from Larry Gilbert, the terminator.
Lam and Grim Reeper,
Larry is one of the kindest people I know. He is my friend and was standing up for me. That’s it.
I sincerely hope that these battles between the blogs over personal items will come to an end.
I know some of the people involved and I can truthfully say that I beleive they all want to help the community as a whole.
All of us have human failings, we get mad and at times seek revenge. But in the end anger and actions resulting from anger only serve to bring down all parties involved.
I hope that all involved can see that it is in everyones best interest to end this infighting and move on to debating and discussing real issues.
Jim and Heather,
Amen to that!
Art, you are only 42 years old and you’ve been married for 23 years? 23 years of marriage is admirable.
What the hell, Art knows what he’s done the last few years on the blog. Looks like he’s willing to change. I hope to let the past go and look forward to the future. Besides, when a man brings up his mother, wife, kids and a troubled mortgage… how can you not feel him.
Lam,
Thank you for those comments. I am not the monster some have made me out to be. I am just another fallible human being…
Yes that is Art.
F***ing Chameleon!
Fiala,
I prefer when your comments are about shoes! But thanks for thinking of me…
The following should be required reading/thinking by EVERYONE involved in this escapade.
“Althea”
Words by Robert Hunter; music by Jerry Garcia
Copyright Ice Nine Publishing; used by permission.
I told Althea I was feeling lost
Lacking in some direction
Althea told me upon scrutiny
my back might need protection
I told Althea that treachery
was tearin me limb from limb
Althea told me: now cool down boy –
settle back easy Jim
You may be Saturday’s child all grown
moving with a pinch of grace
You may be a clown in the burying ground
or just another pretty face
You may be the fate of Ophelia
sleeping and perchance to dream –
honest to the point of recklessness
self centered to the extreme
Ain’t nobody messin with you but you
your friends are getting most concerned –
loose with the truth
maybe it’s your fire
but baby…don’t get burned
When the smoke has cleared, she said,
that’s what she said to me:
You’re gonna want a bed to lay your head
and a little sympathy
There are things you can replace
and others you cannot
The time has come to weigh those things
this space is getting hot –
you know this space is getting hot
I told Althea
I’m a roving sign –
that I was born to be a bachelor –
Althea told me: Ok that’s fine –
So now I’m out trying to catch her
Can’t talk to me without talking to you
We’re guilty of the same old thing
Talking a lot about less and less
And forgetting the love we bring
Henry,
That was very fitting. Thanks for sharing!
wow this is so disgusting; the power games in Orange County. Im still confused as to what you plan on doing in response to the lawsuit, but i did ride past Mr and Mrs. Gallinger on one of my bike rides in Irvine the other day, i should have said something haha.
nonetheless, just remember what comes around goes back around.
Irvine Reporter,
Blogs are still somewhat of an emerging phenomena in politics. We may one day look back at this dark chapter with a different perspective.
I will say this for Mr. Gallinger. He has been very patient with me. I know a lot about a lot of things, but not the law. I am sorry he was dragged into this.
I believe there is only one man who can help Art and bring the OJ and LiberalOC blogs together and that is Santa Ana neighborhood leader Jim Walker. Jim lives in the Sandpointe neighborhood and his made a living solving problems like this. I believe that if you put Art, and Dan and Jim in a room together for 3 hours on a Saturday morning WITHOUT lawyers, they could figure out a way to avoid all of this legal hastle and give Art and his wife and kids back the life they deserve. Does anyone out there know how to contact Jim Walker?
Walker this way,
Jim is a good guy. We supported him for the Santa Ana City Council in 2008. He did quite well actually for having no budget.
I don’t know what is left to resolve. We gave the URLs in question back to GoDaddy. I have taken steps right in this post that I think are in the right direction. We are trying to do the right thing.
That said, if anyone wants to help mediate this mess, please contact Dan Chmielewski and let’s have a go at it!
What is left Pedroza?……. Punitive damages?
You must be punished, perhaps to be deported to your homeland Mexico!
Fiala,
Sigh. I was born here Stanley.
Bows to Lam Pho. (I understand respect). Waves at ocgirl! (I understand respect). Gives Larry Gilbert the finger! (I understand respect.)
Art you should man up. That link to NAMBLA was not a prank. A prank is when you call up the local drug store and ask if they have Prince Albert in a can. What you did was much much worse and you should admit it. Your coming clean lacked that.
I was impressed with how quickly you manned up to say you made a mistake with your comment about Measure D. That took some real stones as saying that in public isn’t easy and you could have easily deleted my comment, changed the text, and hardly anyone would have noticed.
Do the right thing here, Art. Admit what you did was seriously wrong on many many levels.
Little Big Man,
You’re right. It was out of character for me.
There really is no excuse. Yes, I felt terribly betrayed that a guy who was supposed to be my friend sold my personal URL to Dan Chmliewski of all people. But I overreacted.
If I had a chance to do it over I would handle it a different way. Alas, you can’t put the demons back in Pandora’s box.
Now you might ask why these fellas went after me in the first place, but really, after all that has been done and said, does that really matter?
It is time to put this all behind us. All of us have done and said things that I think, in hindsight, we regret. This mess could go on forever really. Which is why I decided to stop it now, fall on my sword and hope for the best.
You’re right it doesn’t matter what they did. We are each only responsible for our own actions. That’s what we have to explain on judgement day. Perhaps you should look around your landscape here, Art.
This blog thrives on personal attacks. They live in the comments. Take Gilbert for instance: saying “’I’m not as forgiving as others on the Juice team regarding your personal attacks. Take note!” Is nowhere near saying “One of our rules is that while you can sign on without providing your name we take issue with the use of profanity or attacks against family members. Don’t use language that Art’s children cannot read.”
To pretend Larry didn’t threaten Lam is transparent to anyone who is actually paying attention. Gilbert is a loose cannon most of the time. We all know this. He allows his friends to take cheap shots, and is the first to stomp on someone like Girl Scout Leader. He needs lessons in civility.
LBM. Go away.
The fact that this keyboard helped bring down your buddy Lance must really make you angry.
The good news is that the Supreme Court just voted to support my right to keep and bear arms
LBM.
While Lam accepts my answer you are so blinded with hatred toward me that you can’t help yourself from attacking me every chance you get.
The good news is that I shall continue to provide coverage for our other readers.
LBM Did you notice that I didn’t delete your complimentary comment?
Larry, is that a threat? It really sounds like a threat. Lam seems to express reason and thought. Are you afraid of that?
girl scout leader,
Larry isn’t threatening anyone. He is just standing up for a friend.
Larry is a real gentleman and not the sort who would resort to violence.
girl scout leader.
I’m not afraid of anyone making a point in debating the post topics.
One of our rules is that while you can sign on without providing your name we take issue with the use of profanity or attacks against family members. Don’t use language that Art’s children cannot read.
Not a threat. If someone engages in that practice we can simply delete the comment in whole or in part.
Each of us gives of our time to provide posts to inform or entertain you the readers.
My point is simple. Don’t wear out your welcome. Disagree all you want on any of our posts but don’t pull down the bar as we work to improve our “free” product.
Larry,
Well said my friend!
“One of our rules is that while you can sign on without providing your name we take issue with the use of profanity or attacks against family members”
Oh I see Larry, so you’re saying that if we provided our real name, then it’s ok to use profanity or attack family members? Is that what you’re saying Larry. So I guess people like Larry Gilbert and Art Pedroza and Sean Mills can attack people them scumbags and what have you, but little anon posters like myself aren’t allowed to fight back.
Thank you Larry for waking me up to reality. I appreciate the cold water in the face. Damn, for a while there I was going soft on Art. Whew… almost fell for it.
So Larry, tell me, were you threatening me Larry? Explain what you meant by not forgiving and I need to “take note”. Direct answer Larry. Take note that you might delete my post or did you have something else in mind Larry? That was a direct threat to me and I need a direct answer Larry!!!
Lam,
No, that is not what Larry is saying. He is saying that we don’t allow the use of curse words and attacks on family members. I think he was rather clear about that.
The word scumbag isn’t a curse word, so if you want to use it, go ahead.
Larry was just standing up for me after your initial nasty comments. So was Sean for that matter. They are my friends so that should be no surprise.
You could have said what you wanted to say without all the odd sexual innuendo. Most of the time you are able to make your points without resorting to such verbiage.
That is really the entire point of the underlying post. Can we say what we want to say without all the bile? I think so. I may be proven wrong but I am appealing to all of our better natures.
There are few people who are truly evil. Most of us try to do what is right. We are human and sometimes we stray a bit and say things we shouldn’t.
At any rate, it is late and Vern and I just had a long chat. I am tuckered out. Have a good night.
Lam.
Get serious! I don’t care in you use your real name or an alias. Our policy is clear as pointed out by Art and myself.
If you wish to continue adding your opinion on the Juice simply refrain from profanity and personal attacks. Is this too difficult to comprehend?
Threat. No, if I happen to see text that I find violates our policy we can either delete specific language and, if it continues, delete the comment in its entirety. Are you looking to pick a fight?
If you are troubled by my answer you can always cancel your free subscription. You are not the only one reading our blog. As we promote the Juice there have been individuals who have advised me on the need to create and enforce a blog usage policy if I want them to join in the debate.
Simply stated. All of us work to raise the bar. We don’t need someone coming in with the intent to sabatoge our collective efforts. All readers can express opposition to our posts without resorting to some of the text that we continue to read.
Lam. That’s a direct answer to your request!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That was all I wanted Larry, a direct explanation. Your explanation doesn’t make a lot of sense to me, but if you say it wasn’t a threat, I’ll take your word for it.
Why didn’t it make sense??
You clearly made a threat… not only was it apparent to me, but other readers saw it that way too… and yet, you’re asking if I’m looking to pick a fight. My god, you like to turn things around. But again, if you are clarifying that it wasn’t a threat, then ok.
Second, while Art admitted mistakes and was asking for forgiving, even quoting the bible about forgiveness. You jumped in and added a scripture yourself… Remember?? What was it exactly that you quoted?
“Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.”
Then you turned around and tell me you’re not as forgiving and threaten me. My god, you are a freakin hypocrite, now that I went back to re-read the thread.
Lastly, you make me sick with your “work to raise the bar” and “don’t use language Art children cannot read”. Why is it ok for your buddies to call someone a scumbag or say Matt Cunningham is pimping his wife? I’m not even going into the NAMBLA thing. The point is OJ bloggers have said outrageous things on here but when the comment is directed back at you, then we hear about “raising the bar” and no personal attack.
Art seems to be sincere, or at least he’s trying. You as his friend isn’t helping much.
Bottom line, I’m glad you clarified the threat or non-threat Larry.
Lam. Change takes time.
You have no way on knowing my feelings about some of the language that has been permitted on the blog. What you are also not aware of is that I while I spend many hours researching and posting my reports, I rarely read and critique other blogger stories and their reader/author comments. You may not believe it but we are working to elevate the quality of this blog and some of the language that some may use limits that improvement. Recognize that I am part of a team of volunteers who communicate with our own styles.
Art and I have been friends for over a decade. Feel free to point out where I have used any language you would consider offensive. I sat by and watched Art take hits from all sides, including yours, which is why I jumped in with my reply and scripture reference.
Ask Vern and Art. I have deleted some comments that, in my opinion, were offensive to our other readers. In some cases I deleted one or two words to retain the overall comment message rather than sending the writer to the dead letter trash can.
Feel free to disagree with me. If you were to read my posts you would quickly recognize that you are not alone. I don’t believe that you can label me as a hypocrite but here again we all have free speech.
Enjoy the rest of the weekend.
But Art, you of all people should know that our reputations are not built solely on the majority of our actions or words. Unfortunately, we are often known for our worst. Witness: Chris Brown (R&B singer), General McCrystal, Marv Albert, the list goes on and on. Your reputation outside of your blog circle is that of a pompous, loudmouth jerk. I don’t mean that it is deserved or not – it is simply the reality. You can repair that damage, but it takes time and you will have to change your ways. I wish you well, and hope you are able to do it.
Ocgirl,
You are comparing me to people who have committed assault and sexual battery?
The last time I got in a physical altercation was in the 5th grade when I fought a bully who was picking on the only African American at my school.
I have been married for 23 years. I do not cheat on my wife.
I reacted angrily when a supposed friend sold my personal url to a guy who loathes me. That makes me a monster in your eyes?
Good grief.
And the only folks who will agree with your assessment of me are the Mexican bashers in town. People who know me know I am neither pompous nor loud-mouthed.
Don’t bother replying. It is clear how you feel about me. Nothing I say will change that. Plus I have to go prepare the food for my daughter’s graduation party.
My advice is that you swallow your bile and move on. Being bitter isn’t a nice character trait.
Art…why don’t you just plead guilty and avoid jail time? Even if you pay their legal costs plus fines it won’t be more than $50,000- $100,000. and over a life time you can earn that back if you move into an apartment to save money. Just a thought.
Give peace a chance,
It isn’t peace to put my innocent family on the streets. That would be a massive injustice.
Bridges, once burned, are usually impossible to rebuild.
“There can only be one!” Stay tough Art…..you are not the only Gulliver out there!
Fool me once,
I agree. My goal is to avoid mutual assured destruction, not to rebuild past friendships.
Art —
It takes real, mature change to lay out all you have said here — even if your detractors nay say all the way.
Gabriel,
Thank you my friend. I truly appreciate your words of support.
Please ask your friends to contact the guys at the Liberal OC and ask them to drop this lawsuit. Thanks!
Wow, I just spent a half hour reading every single comment. What an eye opener!
Art said: There are few people who are truly evil. Most of us try to do what is right. We are human and sometimes we stray a bit and say things we shouldn’t.
So true. I know what true malignant intent is, (I have seen it in action) as opposed to someone thinking that they are being witty or devious. At one time in my life, I was a walking train wreck, screwing up everyone who knew me. It was honestly never intentional, as a matter of fact, I usually had good intentions, and I spent many years making up for past deeds. Thank goodness this was my youth, and middle age has brought temperance and some modicum of wisdom. I have learned to never ascribe evil intent to someone’s actions without first exploring all other motives, as the evil intent is usually the most unlikely. You are apparently now middle aged Art. And I admire your courage greatly. It takes a big man to say I was wrong and swallow the bile that comes with it. Please keep it up, because I see you as one of the truly influential forces of our community.
I am so glad that I am coming to know you at this particular point in your life. I appreciate this space that you have built, and come to it often to learn more about local politics. The journey has been a bit scary and frustrating at times, as you can note from my past comments. I get very frustrated when I see those who clearly care about their local issues slinging mud at each other instead of attacking our true enemies. We are all in this battle to save California together and when we recognize this fact, we will be an unstoppable force.
I am not sitting here, blowing “Kum ba yah” up every one’s ass thinking that we can all get along on every issue, but lets hash that all out later, ok? We have a big election coming up; one that could change the landscape of California for years to come. Among the issues: voters will be asked if they want to repeal nearly $2 billion in corporate tax breaks in an already business unfriendly economy; eliminate the two-thirds majority lawmakers need to pass a state budget, which could be scary or good, depending on the budget; make it tougher to raise fees and other charges in the Legislature; and abolish a citizens’ commission to redraw legislative districts. We will also see landmark initiatives, from legalizing marijuana to suspending the state’s greenhouse gas laws, to borrowing $11 billion for new dams and other water infrastructure.
This is really huge stuff, and yet I daily run into people who don’t even know there is an election coming up!!!!! Art is an essential force in our fight to inform the local population. Let’s do what we can to keep what he has built going.
I for one, appreciate your support, Art, and am proud to have it.
As far as your personal financial difficulties, I know how you feel. My husband and I lost our house (a great mortgage deal, incidentally) due to his health problems, and had to depend on family to keep a roof over our heads many times. I am, as we speak, still rebuilding from this loss. Donny lost his job due to illness, and I had to quit to care for him and take a very low paying wage job. We went from 100,000 a year to 25,000 a year. Even now, we are scary broke sometimes because of the economy and I face each day as an impoverish student. I tell you all of this to say that, even though we lost everything, we still have our family. God will provide. Have faith and peace of heart. Whatever happens will be the best if you have faith. After all, I wouldn’t be getting my degree now, and running for office here if it weren’t for our many losses. You are embracing good Karma, and good Karma will embrace you. 🙂
Much love,
Debbie Tharp
Debbie,
Thanks for your heartfelt comments and your support!
This blog has indeed become a unique place to visit in the O.C. blogosphere. And I think it will be even better absent the blog war, which has become so tiresome.
We do indeed have huge issues on the horizon, including the possibility that we are entering the third depression in our nation’s history. Now more than ever we must stay informed and engaged. Politics as usual, I think, is over…at least in our generation.
Well, If you ask me, all of these blogs are idiotic, and you reap what you sow. These blogs, including yours, Art, have been responsible for the grief of many families. You borderline militant at times.
These blogs get away with a lot and have no circumstances… so they keep acting like idiots.
I feel for your family, but you have brought this onto yourself… just as you have cause other families to suffer indirectly by your actions.
Notice I am not giving my name. Why? Because I’m still afraid of you and your brownshirts.
Best wishes to you family, and as for you… Now you know how your victims feel.
Oh please,
And yet, here you are…
If we are so horrid, why not just ignore us? No one is compelling you to read us.
Oh Please.
While Art surely can defend himself you do raise the question for the rest of us who devote our time and efforts providing these articles. Based on the number of readers and comments we receive I would place you in a very small minority.
The expression that “you cannot please all of the people all of the time” is valid.
That being said, why are you here?
Oh Please, These blogs wouldn’t be idiotic if they all came clean and stopped pretending to be newspapers. All blogs are opinion. Every last one I’ve ever seen from the Huffington Post to this one. These people are bloggers not journalists. Plain and simple. It’s the pretense that makes them seem idiotic. The worst of the lot, oddly, isn’t this blog, but one like the Mission Viejo Dispatch. On this blog it’s completely clear you’re reading opinion. But the guy who runs the Dispatch works insanely hard to make it look respectable so that he can attack who he wants at will and have it pass for news.
Art, I’m not just picking on your blog here. I lump the ocliberal in with the rest of them too. Actually Voice of Dissent plays it pretty straight as far as being opinion. Maybe you can turn this blog around and be more honest about it being opinion.
LBM.
Unlike, Art who has a job and should be away from his keyboard, I will take your “compliment” and respond that we never advertised ourselves as being a newspaper even though we have scooped the Register on several stories over the years of our existence.
Please let us know when your blog will be on line so that we can take pot shots at you as you do to others.
Larry,
Thanks! I am leaving you in charge of responding to LBM the rest of the day as I do have work to do!
Little Big Man,
I, for one, have never pretended to be a newspaper. Yes, at times we do break news stories. However I have always made it clear that what we offer, for the most part, is opinion.
And yes, I agree that we are not journalists. Of course there are few decent journalists left in the OC, which has created a vacuum that the blogosphere has filled.
I did study journalist at CSUF and UCI and I worked on the UCI school paper for a time. And I worked at the OC Register in several capacities as a young man. Those experiences have served me well over the years.
If there is one thing we try to do that many other blogs don’t do, it is to offer all sides, as opposed to being merely right or left. Our bloggers include Republicans, Democrats, Libertarians, and a member of the Green Party. I believe it is that diversity of opinion that has made us a popular blog. That, and our mix of local and national coverage…
I just finished reading this post. All I have to say to you Art is BRAVO! You are a courageous man whose post is heartfelt. My father also had a saying, “It’s lonely at the top”. I know it’s difficult keeping your blog going in spite of all then envy others have of your success and their attempts to destroy you.
Ankle Biter,
Thank you! I got another nastygram from the Liberal OC lawyer yesterday, so I guess we have their answer. They still want to pursue the blog war. That is sad but we will continue to seek the high road.
I am proud of the work we are doing on both our blogs. Our readership speaks for itself.
I am also so happy that many of my friends in the community are talking to the Liberal OC guys and asking them to drop the case, including numerous elected officials from the Democratic Party. Thanks to each of you for making the effort!
Hi Art, it’s been a while. Just read this entry. I don’t know whatever became of this situation, but I want you to say thank you for always treating me with kindness and compassion. I know you only want the best for the city in which you live. Sending prayers. ~Crystal