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You’ve probably heard already what happened last night in the Badger State. To wit:
- after pretending this whole time that stripping the public employee unions of their right to collectively bargain was somehow related to the budget and so needed a quorum;
- after spending all this past week pretending to the media, Democrats and the public that they were getting ready to compromise;
- after every single poll showing public opinion in Wisconsin and nationwide turning firmly against their draconian union-busting plan:
Scott Walker and his 18 loyal Republican Senators suddenly and with no warning or notice stripped bargaining rights from public employee unions, finally admitting that it had nothing to do with the budget and so didn’t need a quorum after all. And remember, neither Walker nor any of these Senators had said anything about doing this shit when they were campaigning for office. This was NOT what Wisconiners voted for.
Such desperate, unpopular, and unlawful lengths they’ll go to just to please their billionaire patrons!
- “This is my Beloved Son,
in whom I am well pleased.”
It’s likely this move – which seems to have broken Wisconsin’s open meeting rules and requirements for notice on such legislation – will not survive legal challenge.
But one thing’s for sure – this dirty move just stiffens Winsconsiners’ resolve to go full steam ahead with the recalls of the eight susceptible Senators that did this (and come January, the malevolent Governor himself.) If even half of the Senate recalls are successful that will be enough to shift control of the Senate to the Democrats. This undemocratic overreach of these anti-labor extremists is likely to turn Wisconsin blue for some years to come, and teach a salutary lesson to the extremists in some other states who are attempting even crazier power grabs.
Over the coming weeks we’ll be looking forward to updates from Wisconsin OJ friend Barb Tappa, who’s taking a leadership role recalling Senator Robert Cowles in her hometown of Green Bay (go PACKERS!) WE can help with the heroic work in Wisconsin by clicking here, or here, or here. I gave $8 the other day, but now I’m so pissed off that when payday comes I’ll give another $80. Remember, if we don’t stop them in Wisconsin now, they’ll be taking over the whole country.
*Thsi will be one of the most fun things that happen to lawmakers since Boss Tweed!
rw
Vern, you are really out to lunch on this one:
“Such desperate, unpopular, and unlawful lengths they’ll go to just to please their billionaire patrons”
I assume that you are talking about the union members protecting the interests of their rich union bosses?
And now you have gone and gotten a law degree?
“It’s likely this move – which seems to have broken Wisconsin’s open meeting rules and requirements for notice on such legislation – will not survive legal challenge.”
Really? The portion of the bill adopted today has been on the floor of the Wisconsin legsiature for the past three weeks. All that was done is that the financial portions of the bill were removed. If you are going to argue that floor modification of any bill requires renotice, then about 99.9% of all legislation nationally is void. Good luck with that lame argument.
The Dems just thought they had pulled a fast one and they just had their pants pulled off instead.
“ ‘Such desperate, unpopular, and unlawful lengths they’ll go to just to please their billionaire patrons’ ” –
I assume that you are talking about the union members protecting the interests of their rich union bosses?”
Doing a little Peewee Herman here are we? I know you are but what am I? No, I was referring to the desperate, unpopular and (possibly) unlawful acts of Walker and his phalanx, meant to please the Koch Brothers and sundry plutocrats. I thought I made that clear with my illustration and bible quote.
“The portion of the bill adopted today has been on the floor of the Wisconsin legsiature for the past three weeks. All that was done is that the financial portions of the bill were removed. If you are going to argue that floor modification of any bill requires renotice, then about 99.9% of all legislation nationally is void.”
Hm, is THIS the line we’re going to be hearing now from the right? The bill was hardly changed at all by having ALMOST EVERYTHING stripped out of it except the most controversial part? Sounds fishy to me. We’ll see how courts rule, I think I know enough about the law, without having a degree, to say what I think is “likely.” Of course that means I COULD turn out wrong.
Vern,
I love your use of the buzz words like “undemocratic” and “unlawful” without recognizing (color me surprised) the indefensibly undemocratic actions of the state Senate Democrats who took their ball and went to Illinois rather than let the true democratic process work itself out. And what a surprise that it is only the Democrats who have resorted to this process recently and in the past (with turncoat Texas Democrats). I like the maxim “actions speak louder than words.” The Democrats have shown their true scorn for democracy and you latch on to things like improper notice. You also must have missed the emails where Governor Walker (even though he had no obligation) offered to compromise on his legislation (including eliminating the inflation limit on pay increases). However, he would not compromise on the real issue – ending the mandatory union dues which are used as an unlimited fund for Democrat campaigns. Fortunately the Democrats’ actions say all that needs to be said. The unions and Democrat legislators don’t care about the people. All they care about is getting re-elected and maintaining their power.
Vern, your Ellis piece shows you are generally a thorough researcher, but you dropped the ball here. From a November 3, 2009 article: “Walker, a Republican, said Monday if elected next year he would cut wages and benefits for workers so the state could afford tax cuts.”
http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/news/68991847.html
In 2006, Scott Fitzgerald, Senate Majority Floor Leader sponsored a bill urging Congress not to enact the Employee Free Choice Act regarding unions. Glen Grothman did as well.
http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/Scott_Fitzgerald
http://ballotpedia.org/wiki/index.php/Glenn_Grothman
To claim they didn’t campaign on this is simply wrong.
Also, your math may be a little messed up if any of the 6 Democrat Senators who have recall efforts against them lose.
*sigh* Newbie. (Oh first of all, your comments have been going into spam today, I DON’T KNOW WHY, but I’ve been saving them out. Larry, could you help me keep an eye on the spam filter?)
That 2009 quote about Walker has absolutely nothing to do with the crux of the issue, which is eviscerating bargaining rights.
And the “employee free choice act” – that also has nothing to do with the issue at hand. How can you conflate so many different things?
Let’s see – Walker’s recent pretenses at compromise were just that – pretenses.
And denying a quorum is a constitutionally legitimate, if desperate, resort of a minority.
Let’s see, is there anything left? Oh, the Democrats don’t care about the people? Those were sure a lot of bullshit polls then (even from Rasmussen!) and very Potemkin rallies, eh?
Oh yeah, you did say one last thing – you imagined that some of the Democrat(ic) Senators could be recalled. LOLOL they’re considered heroes now by their constituents! Those be ASTRORECALLS! I’ll place money on this.
I am sure that they are considered heroes by the mindless few led by the union bosses. Time will tell which of us is right about the impact of these events – I tend to believe that the silent majority (using that term in a purely descriptive not political way) will view the GOP senators as having done their job and kept to their campaign promises while the Dems petulantly skipped out of state encouraging mobs of angry and violent folks to entirely shut down the democratic process.
A quorum break actually IS a part of the Democratic process, you know. That’s not illegal or “against the rules” or whatever. Is this like the way the Right Wing talks about the Constitution: where it always supports whatever they think it supports?
And a quorum break is a lot more brave and politically risky than the faux filibuster Republicans have been using constantly to block or slow down every Obama nomination or piece of legislation (of which there WAS open debate, concessions and compromise, something Scott Walker made clear he would not do).
Also, mandatory union dues that go toward Democratic causes? Surely you’re joking. If you’d done any research, you’d know you can claim an objection on political or religious grounds and have those dues given to charity in place of to a political cause. Course, I don’t expect your sources of information would often mention this little detail.
But if you’re so concerned about groups who contribute politically and don’t care about the people, you might look to Walker’s own corporate contributors. Thanks to Citizens United, the Republicans now have an unlimited fund from big business donors (which is not to say they don’t also do the same with Democratic candidates to help strengthen their hold on this lovely little Plutocracy we’re in, they just primarily work with conservatives).
Gutting unions and removing collective bargaining is a great way to erode worker’s rights and increase corporate control (and see short term profits, because unhappy workers are less productive, but hey, they’ll worry about it when it gets to that point, right? Why think things through? That’s kind of a liberal thing). It also makes it a lot easier for Walker to sell the state owned property to Koch owned business in no bid contracts when the time comes. Wouldn’t want anyone around with enough power to raise a stink over that.
And saying Walker was going to cut benefits is nebulous. Saying he’s going after collective bargaining in particular? Kind of a different story. A lot of people who voted for him are now against him and the polls are not favorable to him (unless you watch Fox News and they flip the numbers.. which they have done.)
Oh, speaking of the short-sightedness of the Kochs and like-minded business leaders… is it any surprise that their focus is laser-honed strictly on short-term profit? After all, these are some of the biggest polluters around who, despite lying through their teeth, know full well that anthropogenic climate change is a reality and they’re helping it along… but hey, they’re getting rich now. That’s all that matters, right?
And they gin up support among the tea party because, like I said, if Al Gore or the liberals are for something, they’ve got to be against it.
Or you’ve got the reasoning of the religious right, who think “Well, global warming can’t happen because it’s not in the Bible… and even if it did, all the good people would be raptured before it got too uncomfortable on the planet!”
That kind of unpleasant mindset really makes you sleep better at night knowing how many nukes we have and how many ELECTED OFFICIALS believe in the apocalypse…. and are rather eager to bring it about.
If you’d done any research, you’d know you can claim an objection on political or religious grounds and have those dues given to charity in place of to a political cause. Course, I don’t expect your sources of information would often mention this little detail.
Hey, that’s true! I know a Republican Teacher’s Union member down in the Capo District that does that, and gives his dues to United Way instead. I’d forgotten about that. Thanks!
One whole union member Vern, wow it’s a landslide. Mags is the one with her head in the sand trying to claim that exceptions that are either not publicized or get you ostracized somehow justify the buckets of money that unions throw at Democratic candidates without their members’ true consent.
umm…
I’m pretty fucking busy, does somebody want to see how often this exception is taken advantage of by union members? The “you can claim an objection on political or religious grounds and have those dues given to charity in place of to a political cause.” It’s not heard of because the righties aren’t out there yelling about it, and it blows a hole in their arguments. I bet union members all know about that, and many of them take advantage of it. Any out there?
I donated to Act Blue last night. Wasn’t much, but it felt good, man.
It’s also kind of amusing to watch people like Geoff twist their brains into pretzels to try to think this is a good thing. A lot of it stems from pettiness, however. Many conservatives, I find, oppose Democrats simply because, well, they don’t like Democrats. It helps that they have a near-constant, 24 hour hate talk/propaganda echo chamber to keep them confused, misled and angry.
Honestly, if liberals came out with a statement today that breathing oxygen is necessary to live, John Boehner would start weeping on television, Glenn Beck would accuse socialists of putting something in the air and thus wanting to encourage us to breathe more to take it all in, James Inhofe would claim there’s huge controversy about this whole “air” theory in the scientific community, and Sarah Palin and the Tea Party would hold their breath until they passed out.
ROTLMAO. And Rush would bellow about the OXYNAZIS, and his maid would mishear and grab him some little pills.
One of the vulnerabilities resulting from union negotiations over the years is a tendency to include things in agreements that treat some employees as special whereas the rest are not.
Just heard a Wisconsin legislator on John and Ken mention that union workers who were required to carry a pager when off duty because they might be called to come to work or otherwise handle an emergency received 5 hours a week of extra pay, whether or not they were ever called. That means these workers earned about 12% more than the non-pager carrying others. In some jurisdictions there are similar differentials for being able to speak a foreign language (such as Spanish) when that language skill is needed to deal with the public, or more pay for working a crummy shift (nights or weekends). It is also not unusual for these union agreements to relieve union officers from doing some or any work for the municipality, making them basically taxpayer paid union officials.
Pretty soon there are so many special pays on top of regular pay it is a maze, and even if there is some logic that justifies each one individually, when it is all laid out for the public to see many of the public become infuriated.
Another problem is a tendency in some negotiations to grant a fringe benefit rather than a raise – for instance for the municipal employer to pay a larger share of the monthly retirement fund cost, or granting another week of vacation, or granting two days a month more of sick leave, or granting time off for personal business, etc.
Eventually it becomes mind boggling, especially to a person who never heard of such things in their private sector work. This atmosphere is one of the things now working against public sector unions in Wisconsin, and elsewhere. Unions would be wise to negotiate to consolidate pay items and strive for a basic wage for all. Of course, that risks making real pay levels visible to the taxpayer.
I agree unions aren’t perfect and, like any system, can be abused or gamed to the advantage of the cynical, but completely eradicating them is not the answer and the former is no justification for the latter. Without unions, we wouldn’t have minimum wage, vacations, really ANY worker’s right you enjoy even if you aren’t part of a union. It’s better to have a flawed or rotten union that can be changed or fixed than no union at all… and by taking away collective bargaining, you take away the whole point of the union, effectively killing it. This is great for Walker and his Koch financiers, of course, but it’s not so great for the average American who isn’t a billionaire or tool of a billionaire. And given how much influence corporate money now has on government, we need public unions more than ever. Otherwise, they’re going to be unopposed and we’re all going to suffer as a result, make no mistake about that.
Uh Mags, the last time I checked Governor Walker’s bill said nothing about making Wisconsin a right to work state. And Walker was willing to compromise on things like pay increases, but the pouting Democrats ignored him so he passed it the way he wanted.
As for your rah rah history of unions, you actually are making an argument against the need for unions today since most of the workers’ rights you mention are covered by legislation.
And I love the Koch conspiracy theories you on the left always advance while completely ignoring the corporate interets who support the left (ever hear of George Soros?)
Down with poor people! Praise to the rich!
It sure didn’t take Scott Walker long to give the voters of Wisconisn buyer’s remorse! The good news is that Walker, the Wisconsin GOP, and the far right have lit a fire under the progressive movement, much like Prop H8 energized California progressives in 2008.
Keep fighting the good fight, Vern. You have more patience than I do, and your eloquence far exceeds mine. I wish you the best of luck and don’t let the regressives get to you too bad, ok? We need as many rational people as we can get.
Vern, this Mags guy is really insulting you – “patient,” “eloquent,” and “rational” – aren’t those fighting words for you?
This is a fun guy to play with – just to prolific for me to keep up with and keep my day job. He is probably not burdened by that.
Mags gal. Her name is Maggie. You can’t see her e-mail? That reminds me, I could use your help sometimes approving comments when me or Larry are busy…
Just let me know – I am more than willing to help as long as the job doesn’t have me preoccupied.
You’re really misusing this supposedly Orange County focused blog, Nelson. Give it back to Art and leave.
U get lost dude.
Corey —
Did you leave a similar post on the Pro-Walker post?
OJB has always maintained a local focus, but does not practice a complete abstention from issues of state, national and international importance.
”These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland … They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost.”
– Ronald Reagan, Labor Day address, 1980
“Amidst the continued outpouring of praise for Ronald Reagan, let’s not forget that he was one of the most anti-labor presidents in U.S. history.” http://www.dickmeister.com/id89.html
Not that that is a bad thing.
Regarding zombie reagan’s comments on unions, it was wholly opportunistic in regards to Poland and how they challenged the authoritarian state capitalist rule of psuedo-socialists.
His domestic agenda shows the lengths of his insincerity…and the extent that anti-labor/anti-union policies exemplify the democracy deficit of corporate capitalist politics.
Say one thing, do another…
gericault & gsr – you got my head spinnin’
RR on public unions:
“But we cannot compare labor management relations in the private sector with government. Government cannot close down the assembly line. It has to provide, without interruption, the protective services which are governments’ reason for being.”
No duplicity on Ronnie’s part here – he is “down” with private unions and says that public unions do not work – same as junior.
I like the photo portraying the Scots hero freedom fighter William Wallace.
Wouldn’t it have been more fitting to portray the Wisconsin dem legislators as Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys?
No.
Whatever happened to the dem mantra “Elections have consequences” ??
Are we doing that whole call-and-response thing again? This is the last time I do this with you.
HEY! Too bad you weren’t around when all these state Constitutions were formed – when they were writing the pages prescribing and describing recalls, as well as quorum rules, you could have just piped up “Hey, Elections Have Consequences!” And I’m sure they would have paused with their pens still in the air, shrugged, nodded their heads sagely, and kept their constitutions short.
Vern said:
“I hope this latest incident causes the Palin types to choose their metaphors more carefully, and if they don’t I’ll be in the front row of folks shouting them down.”
War Vern .. really? Nice metaphor – I suppose that you are “down” with that east coast legislator that said “it’s time to get a little bloddy.”
Now Vern is in the front row shouting WAR !!
LOL, weren’t we all a little freaked out after the Giffords shooting?
Oh, you weren’t? Well, I was and most people I knew were.
But back to the rough metaphors! I like them! (to a reasonable degree…)
I like the metaphor (kind of) – Cheese Eating Surrender Monkey Wisconsin dem legislators.
You are overusing, and misusing, the term “Metaphor.”
Remember this: “A pretty girl is like a metaphor.” (Jean-Luc Godard.)
*You know that business and government is corrupt when they stop paying off the Larbor Union Bosses. Scotty boy needs to be beamed up…..and the people of Visconsin are now ready to do it. Hopefully, they can recall 15 Republican Senators along the way.
Henry Ford preferred paying off Union Bosses to seeing his employees engaged in the bloodshed. Today, the big boys in charge of business and government are even too cheap
to do that. We can’t wait to see the odds in Vegas!
rw
I just don’t see why everyone’s getting so upset over here in O.C. — except that it’s fun to argue. While I personally think the Wisconsin Republicans are going to drive their government services off a cliff, I’m not sure. I’m kind of glad the experiment is being done there, not here.
BECAUSE, silly! Everybody on both sides knows this is a war with national and local implications, and so should YOU as a teacher. Plus forgive our empathy, plus some of us have Wisconsin friends… But MOSTLY answer #1!
Is that crowd ob barbarians shown in the photo holding sombreros? Sure looks like it.
Now you got it – the labor unrest in Wisconsin is mainly fueled by Scottish Mexicans swarming across the Canadian border.
Brother Vern.
Don’t start picking on Mexicans wherever they live or enter the USA. I would argue that its a lot closer to get goons in Chicago without having to cross any international border.
This is what happens to socialists like Vern Nelson…… You are next!
Nativo Placed Into Custody
Nativo was placed into custody today for defending himself with valid legal language, the psychiatrist doing the medical examination didn’t like the language that he used and presented a negative report.
We need your support in a press conference tomorrow Friday 11 at 10:00am in front of the court house.
210 W. Temple Los Angeles, CA. for more information you can call our office at 714-541-0250.
Show your support for Nativo Lopez. Is time to help him.
Vern said: “But back to the rough metaphors! I like them! (to a reasonable degree…)”
“I know quite a few Marines who will be happy to help these terrorists to an early meeting in paradise” – Deborah Pauly on the terrorist supporting speakers at the YL fundraiser.
Does the above “rough metaphore” meet your criteria for acceptability Vern?
First of all, D Pauly was speaking LITERALLY, of killing Muslims!
Plus I heard her whole fucking speech, she never made it clear that she wasn’t talking about all Muslims, including the Muslims who would be showing up within the hour a short distance away, and even if she had, this was still a death threat. And with lines like that she whipped up the crowd’s frenzy which we saw shortly after in the CAIR video.
“This is war!” is an old accepted metaphor, it doesn’t suggest any kind of physical threat. Silly.
At least, now, I am only “Silly” – not “fxxxxng crazy.”
WI judge puts temporary restraining order on Walker’s union-busting bill:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0311/51556.html
“It seems to me the public policy behind effective enforcement of the open meeting law is so strong that it does outweigh the interest, at least at this time, which may exist in favor of sustaining the validity of the (law),” Sumi said, according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel.
Walker signed the bill into law March 11. Publication of the bill, which LaFollette had scheduled for March 25, would give the highly contested legislation full force and effect…
The district attorney in the case is claiming that the lack of notice given before the conference committee convened is tantamount to a violation of Wisconsin’s open meeting laws, and that the public did not have time to attend the session.
Sumi’s ruling Friday is at least a temporary setback for Walker, who to date has overcome weeks-long protests and an intense media spotlight to push through a budget repair plan that many Democrats and union leaders believe puts a disproportionate burden on many of the state’s public workers, including teachers. If Sumi eventually rules in favor of the public officials challenging the manner in which the bill was passed, lawmakers might be forced to reconsider the legislation, leaving Republicans vulnerable to further protests in Madison like the ones that raged there for weeks…
Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0311/51556.html#ixzz1GyPnbl00
I am happy for you, Nelson!
I recall that Clinton approve execution of the retard as Governor during his presidential campaign.
When guards came to take retard to gas chamber he told them that he is punting his last meal a side and will finish it after he comes back.
Your like thinking.
I love when unions show their true colors:
I’m looking forward to a similar story from you Vern on the other side. Oh wait, we believe in democracy (including the recall process) and not thuggery and intimidation. What are they afraid of?
I went and looked at that, Newbie, since you’re my pal and came to hear me play piano, and I even embedded the video onto your comment for you, but Jesus…. that’s the best you and Breitbart can do?
Somebody wrote “fuck you” on one of their opponents’ forms, and crumpled it? And we have to watch the whole thing with our heads turned like peacocks? Breitbart – NOT WINNING.
Now I’m getting pissed, Newbie. Up your game, dude. I expect better opposition from you!